Smart fortwo Cabrio Roof

[karldonteljames]

Good evening all,

I've just purchase d a 2003 Cabrio for my wife, it has 47k on the clock, but the roof doesn't work.

the first thing I did was sign upto evolution.co.uk and pay my subscription fee on how to fix the issue, however the first step says "lower the roof" This is where the guide loses me, because both motors are turning, but only one side of the roof is opening. I've removed the motors and swapped them over to check it wasn't a motor issue, but the same problem is persisting (same side not opening) Whilst the motors were removed, I noticed that the teeth were missing from the nearside cable where the motor fits. Is there any other way the roof can be fixed at all?

I hope someone can help!!

Many Thanks.

Karl

[Mad smart person]

Greetings Karl, by the sounds of things what you need is a good dose of 'bodgery'. I say that because there's no 'polite' way of possibly getting the roof to open. But before you start, I suggest you get the required parts to repair (they come as a kit per side, I suggest you get two kits and also the roof bow ends) plus the 'allan' key crank handles x2, if you've not got them already? as you'll need them to move the mechanisms manually without the motors in place.
You've got one motor out, good, leave the other in and active. What you need to do is, with one person pressing the open button, the other person needs to be using a flat blade screw driver to try and move the buggered cable along at the same time, - that's where the bodgery comes in, whilst also trying to nudge the leading edge of the roof up. There may be many reasons the cable won't do what it's supposed to do so if it won't move easily, try and find out why before doing too much damage.
As the roof closes normally, at the leading edge, the cables pull down into the top of the A pillar area and latch, you need to get them out of that position, so try moving the damaged cable first by the bodge method, then try a little electricity and try the bodge method again. If you keep the electrics on for too long, all that happens is the roof will become 'cocked' and jammed, making it even harder to move the damaged cable / roof. Once you've got the roof open, check everywhere for little bits of broken plastic, even the smallest bit will stop the roof from closing after you think you've fixed it. Compare sides, to figure out what things should look like, that helps. Be advised though, you need to start this process in a weather proof area - IE a shed or garage, 'cos once you've started it'll take a lot longer than you think and your help will probably have other things to do - not to mention the liquid sunshine!!!
Cheers, Ian.

[karldonteljames]

Thanks Ian, I had a look at this last night, and it looks like I can move the cable on the right with a flat bladed screwdriver, unfortunately I don't have anywhere "weatherproof" at the moment, so it'll have to wait a couple of weeks. I'm going to get a cost today on the replacement of both cables, both supplied and supplied and fitted.

I really appreciate your response, and its given me hope that I can get this sorted. I ordered the winding tools last night, and they will be here by the end of the week.

I've just been checking the MOT history of the car (as the owner didn't have any history prior to him owning it) This made me suspicious at first, but he had been the keeper for about 18 months. since then the alternator belt has been changed as has the battery. I'm going to do an oil and filter change next week, When the car is first started it seems to idle at about 2000rpm, and takes about a minute to settle down to 1000. I've had a look at various sources online, and some say that it takes 0w-40 and others 5/10w-40. Some advice here would be appreciated too please. The car has a 600cc engine. (I was told it has a turbo but the previous owner, but he also told me it was a four cylinder, so I'm not sure)

The only other I have is that the horn doesn't work. the relay is clicking, but the horn itself isn't working, so I suspect a damaged/broken wire. I believe the horn is behind the front under tray, is that correct?

[Ocracoke]

When the car is first started it seems to idle at about 2000rpm, and takes about a minute to settle down to 1000.

That is about right. My 600cc will rev to about 2000 and then settle down to around 1000 after a minute or two.

I've had a look at various sources online, and some say that it takes 0w-40 and others 5/10w-40. Some advice here would be appreciated too please.

I use 5/40w in my remapped 600cc and OOTB 700cc Smarts (the 600cc having being previously used to commute about 450 miles a week) and never had any issues with using it.

The car has a 600cc engine. (I was told it has a turbo but the previous owner, but he also told me it was a four cylinder, so I'm not sure)

All 450's were turbocharged and 3 cylinders.

The only other I have is that the horn doesn't work. the relay is clicking, but the horn itself isn't working, so I suspect a damaged/broken wire. I believe the horn is behind the front under tray, is that correct?

Certainly is (http://www.evilution.co.uk/index.php...terior&mod=284). I'd also possibly consider a dodgy connector at the steering wheel as well if that has been changed but the horn wiring at the horn itself is more likely I would think.

[karldonteljames]

Thanks for the information. really helpful. is there an oil drain plug on these engines or do they have to be drained from the dipstick? This seems a little backwards to me!

Thanks

[heinkeljb]

No drain plug on the sump on the original sump, but people have changed them for ones with a drain plug, so you will have to look for your self! Draining through the dip stick tube is no really a backwards step, one less place for the engine to drip oil from - just as quick if you have the correct kit. If the dip stick tube is positioned correctly and the sump is designed for it, the oil suction system will empty it just as efficiently as a sump with a drain plug.

John

[Thrumbleux]

. I'm going to do an oil and filter change next week, When the car is first started it seems to idle at about 2000rpm, and takes about a minute to settle down to 1000. I've had a look at various sources online, and some say that it takes 0w-40 and others 5/10w-40?

Fast idle on start up as said by others is normal - part of an emissions strategy to warm the cat ASAP.
Pela suction pumps work well (if you haven't already got a pump) but warm the engine first.
I ran (and run) with 15W/40 and got to 76,000 miles before needing a rebuild - higher mileage than most. The W figure is actually the viscosity of oil. The second number (eg 30, 40 etc) is made up with viscosity improvers (not oil) which fail in time. The larger the difference in the numbers, the more dependent on viscosity improvers. Oil is better. For that reason I try and minimise the gap. The only downside is having to take a little more care during warm up - wait until the revs drop before driving off and go easy on the revs for the first few miles.

[karldonteljames]

Thanks for the info. As it stands I've managed to open the roof. The passenger side has dropped down but the drivers side wont drop down, so I can't get the arm out. Any jiggery pokery advise would be helpful.

[karldonteljames]

Thanks for the info. As it stands I've managed to open the roof. The passenger side has dropped down but the drivers side wont drop down, so I can't get the arm out. Any jiggery pokery advise would be helpful.

[karldonteljames]

Thanks for the info. As it stands I've managed to open the roof. The passenger side has dropped down but the drivers side wont drop down, so I can't get the arm out. Any jiggery pokery advise would be helpful.

[karldonteljames]

Thanks for the info. As it stands I've managed to open the roof. The passenger side has dropped down but the drivers side wont drop down, so I can't get the arm out. Any jiggery pokery advise would be helpful.

[karldonteljames]

Sorry for the multiple posts, my phone was telling me that it couldn't be posted.

[karldonteljames]

My wife figured out that the white clip could be lifted to release the second stage of the roof. Once that was removed the cables and motors were removed.
The next issue was that the cables were getting stuck whilst being threaded in, there were some metal shavings inside the track at the point the motors sit.
Once I managed to get the cables in and the roof reassembled, and aligned, the new gears that had been fitted to the motor wouldn't fit into the "gaps" between the cables. Where the old motors had been clicking and grinding the had ground down the metal around the opening and had made it smaller, so that had to shaved back.
Although once the motors were in, and the roof had been re-seated - it all worked a charm!

All in i think it took me about 5 hours, but as my local smart garage (Independent, not dealer) quoted me around £400 in labour, I think it was a good way to spend a sunny day!