Engine cutting out

[Thrumbleux]

Lasted for 5 days before cutting out at low speed so did not bump start.
Restarted straight away .

Was that an improvement from before, ie, after disconnection/reconnection of MEG?

[Thrumbleux]

Crank sensor is not exactly an expensive part, so I would change I would change it just to eliminate it from the list of possible causes.

John

True - but a PITA to get at and seizure prone.

[peanut450]

Was that an improvement from before, ie, after disconnection/reconnection of MEG?

Yes after disconnection/reconnection of the two muti plugs.

[peanut450]

Crank sensor is not exactly an expensive part, so I would change I would change it just to eliminate it from the list of possible causes.

John

I did attempt to change the crank sensor but the bolt is seized in place and have managed to round the torx head .

[Thrumbleux]

Yes after disconnection/reconnection of the two muti plugs.

Have another go at cleaning the connectors. It doesn't take much in the way of dirt or corrosion to corrupt digital signals.

[peanut450]

Ok I will have another go .
Would it be worth spraying with anything ?(WD40 or something better?)
Thanks

[Thrumbleux]

Not WD40. Electrical contact cleaner would be the best I'd guess.
I'd be examining the pins (with a magnifying glass) and carefully scraping off any dirt or corrosion. Cotton buds are good for wiping the loosened dirt off.

[peanut450]

Update- the cutting out still has been happening but seems to be less often. Have tried running fuel system cleaner and then a tank of expensive BP fuel to see if fuel was a problem but no improvement.
On Friday it cut out as I got on a rounderbout but did not bump start. When stopped I had a single bar on the dash and it would not turn over for more the 1 second and could not select a gear.Also there was a clicking from the SAM in time with the hazard lights.
The AA came out and did a battery disconnect to reset the ecu and then it restarted properly and I drove home Ok.
Here is a list of the codes
Instrument (Instrument - KI_450 - MT/AT) DTC Description B1310 - Maximum waiting time was exceeded. - Intermittent
Multifunction (SAM (Signal acquisition and control module)
B1030 - Immobilizer counter overflow or CAN communication is faulty - Intermittent B1022 - Maximum waiting time was exceeded. - Intermittent B1020 - No CAN message was received from engine control unit - Intermittent B1014 - No CAN message was received from engine control unit intermiient.
I have removed the instrument panel and reseated the plugs.
Any ideas???

[Thrumbleux]

It kind of sounds like poor connections to me but this isn't my specialist subject!
Sometimes it's worth Googling the individual fault codes and see where that takes you - ie someone who has had the same and how they fixed it. Hopefully someone on the forum who understands the CANbus system better than me can advise.

[peanut450]

I have been trying to search for the fault codes but no sucsess yet. A lot of searches just end up with vauge suggestions or just generic faults.

[heinkeljb]

Are you getting these codes from a proper Smart compatible diagnostic tool or just a generic tool - Sounds like a generic tool if it gives you codes for Air con which you don't have. That being the case, I wouldn't trust he codes to be correct.

I still think for the cost of the part, change the CPS - If that means dismantling a fair amount of the car because you have rounded off the head of the E bolt - You'll have to get it out at some point, so now is as good a time as any if you can live without a running car whilst you dealt with it.

At the very least, you should unclip as many electrical connectors as you can and give them a good blast with electrical contact cleaner. Obviously, if you want to do this correctly, you do them one at a time so you can test to see if you have cure the issue and which connector was the cause, but most people don't have the patience to do that, so just do them all one after the other.

Just my suggestions.

John

[peanut450]

I am using a Delphi 150 to get the codes so would they be Smart specific or generic?
Today I deleted the fault codes and also checked the connector on the esp under the seat,
Then left it running for 30 mins then rechecked and no fresh codes were there.
As it is an intermittant fault narrowing it down to a single connector will be tricky.
Have been wondering about trying to change the cps but can not see how to remove the bolt as it is rounded off .
Any suggestions welcome
Thanks

[heinkeljb]

The Delphi should be good for the engine codes, but not sure how accurate it will be for the other Smart /Merc codes.

As far as getting the CPS out. there are several different ways you could try, all of which involve a fair amount of dismantling as you need access to the CPS and its bolt.

Soak it for a few days with PLUSGAS penetrating fluid, This actually takes quite a few days to work its way down the threads and the shaft of the CPS, so the longer you can spent soaking it the better. It might even be worth trying to soak it and then drive the car, when the engine / gearbox is warm / hot soak it some more!

You could try just cutting a slot in the head and turn it with a flat blade screw drive. Maybe even use a hand held impact driver and preferably a bit of heat. That can be provided by a hot air gun, but as the gearbox is quite a large lump of metal, getting sufficient heat into it might be difficult.
Another way would be flatten the head off and drill a hole down the middle and work your way up to the correct size to use a thread tap and try to cut the original thread out of the CPS. If you get it right then the layer of metal going through the mounting point of the CPS will be very thin and you should be able to turn the CPS back and forth and pull at the same time to get it to start moving and hopefully out. You will then have to drill and tap the remaining portion of the bolt in the bell housing. Only downside at this point is putting metal filings in to the bell housing - Not good for the clutch if they get in there.

You could try drilling a hole in the bolt and using an easyout to try and and get the bolt out, but my experience of using little sized easyout's is that they break and leave you with a hardened piece of steel to have to get out. Only easy way to get those out is to spark erode them out. Not something the average person can do at home.

Another way would be to cut though the mounting point of the CPS and then twist he body of the CPS back and forth whilst you pull on it to hopefully pull it out. Then you can slowly hack of the plastic round the bolt and grab it with a pair of "Molegrips" and try unwinding it. Again, lots of Plusgas and heat should help getting that out. At this point, you could also go the route of drilling through the bolt.

If you are prepared to separate the gearbox and the engine even if only by a couple of inches, you could just drill through both the CPS and the bolt and clear the rubbish that ends up in the bell housing.

If you have access to a welder, you could try welding a piece of rod to the top of the bolt and then using that to try and turn the bolt out. That would also have the added advantage of putting heat in the bolt which might help break the corrosion bond the is working as a glue between the threads of the bolt and the bell housing.

So could be easy'ish or a real pain in the bum.

Others may have different ideas.

John

[Thrumbleux]

Good post John.
I'll second the idea of getting penetrant/releasant in as early as possible - ie, now! And keep applying it every few days. As per, John's suggestion running the car like that will only help as the heat will help getting the penetrant/releasant into the threads.
Out of all the suggestions I'd probably go for:
''
Another way would be to cut though the mounting point of the CPS and then twist he body of the CPS back and forth whilst you pull on it to hopefully pull it out. Then you can slowly hack of the plastic round the bolt and grab it with a pair of "Molegrips" and try unwinding it. Again, lots of Plusgas and heat should help getting that out.''

You can use a soldering bolt (or heated screwdriver) to melt and break up the CPS mounting boss.

If you have a welder, a nut welded on top of the bolt head can work well - for all the reasons John suggests - and leaves more room to work than a rod welded on.
Good luck!

[peanut450]

The idea of cutting through the mounting to remove the CPS then gripping the bolthead to remove it has been one of my thoughts . Will need to get some Plusgas as all I have is WD40 type stuff.
I have got some reverse drill bits but not sure if there is space to drill square into the bolt.
No time to do anything today.
I am hoping resetting and clearing the fault codes may reduce the likleyhood of a cambus errror?
Have done @8 mile trip with no codes or problems.
Many thanks for the detailed suggestions.
Is it me or does eveyone have trouble posting replies on this forum? This is my second attempt at posting.