Newbie Warning :)

[LukeM88]

Hi All,

Hope everyone is well!

I am looking to buy a Smart Fortwo between 2000 - 2002 , I don't know what model yet, i.e City or Passion etc. But I was wondering if anyone can give me any advice ? any common faults with these vehicles ? any particular things I need to look out for when viewing/purchasing one ?

Thanks All!

Luke

[Thrumbleux]

Re: Newbie Warning

All you need to know can be found written on a packet of Rice Krispies.

SNAP: front springs
CRACKLE: exhaust manifold
POP: engine.

[problemchild1976]

Re: Newbie Warning

As above - go into this eyes open.

Engines are the weak point.

Total failure is acommon, expected (and somewhat accepted) issue! Not just like a rover where the head gasket can go or sensors failing. Failure and rebuild.

Of course not all do but it should be factored in when considering.

Or buy one from one of the independents on here that has already had a rebuild

JJ

[LukeM88]

Re: Newbie Warning

SNAP CRACKLE & POP ! Easy to remember !

Thanks guys! Dont get me started on the rover engines haha!

Appreciated guys !

Luke

[Thrumbleux]

Re: Newbie Warning

Luke: If you are pegged at an early model due to a tight budget then be very very careful as repairs can be costly and if you don't have the immediate funds to cover them then it ends badly with more money lost.
They are great little cars but they are better bought with as large a budget as possible in order to buy as good a car as is possible. There are some bodged up horrors out there - buy one and it will bankrupt you.
As PC above says - buy from an indy with a reputation to preserve - or buy something else for now at least. The only real exception to this is if you are handy with spanners - in which case buy one needing a rebuild for cheap, rebuild its engine , and you're quids in.

[MrPoo]

Re: Newbie Warning

Luke: If you are pegged at an early model due to a tight budget then be very very careful as repairs can be costly and if you don't have the immediate funds to cover them then it ends badly with more money lost.
They are great little cars but they are better bought with as large a budget as possible in order to buy as good a car as is possible. There are some bodged up horrors out there - buy one and it will bankrupt you.
As PC above says - buy from an indy with a reputation to preserve - or buy something else for now at least. The only real exception to this is if you are handy with spanners - in which case buy one needing a rebuild for cheap, rebuild its engine , and you're quids in.

+1

Out of curiosity, what is your budget?

City isn't a trim level, early fortwos were called City Coupes. You'll either find them described as Smart+Passion (v. early models) or in the trim levels of Pure, Passion, Pulse and (unlikely at that age) Brabus.

Also, the age is key as to whether your get RHD or LHD, you'll only get RHD from late 2001 (51 plate) onwards, reg's S - Y will all be LHD. You can save anything up to £1k by buying LHD, if you're happy driving it. Just make sure it's already rebuilt, or you have £1k set aside for repairs.

[LukeM88]

Re: Newbie Warning

Annoyingly I just replied but it hasnt shown !!

Anyhow I have a £2k budget, is that not enough ? I am only looking to get a Smart due to them being a nice-looking-cheap-to-run car. Just want a decent one for the money I will be paying .....

RHD and LHD will not bother me as I'll drive anything with 4 wheels

I'll be taking my best friend with me to view as he is a very good mechanic so hoping he can point out if there are any obvious faults....



L

[MrPoo]

Re: Newbie Warning

Anyhow I have a £2k budget, is that not enough ? I am only looking to get a Smart due to them being a nice-looking-cheap-to-run car. Just want a decent one for the money I will be paying .....

You could get a half decent car for that, but keep some money aside for repairs. They're not as reliable/cheap to run as you'd think, tax, insurance and fuel are all cheap, but the maintenance can get costly.

[LukeM88]

Re: Newbie Warning

You could get a half decent car for that, but keep some money aside for repairs. They're not as reliable/cheap to run as you'd think, tax, insurance and fuel are all cheap, but the maintenance can get costly.

I have other money aside for emergencies

why is it that they 'can' be costly ? is anything prone to happen buddy ??

ideally I would like to find a low mileage one, however the ones I have been looking at are like 70-80k

[137699]

Re: Newbie Warning

£2k is about the entry point for a decent example.
Engines start consuming oil at around 60,000 miles (+/- 20,000) a problem that gets steadily worse until the engine goes pop. The only solution is a rebuild - at a cost of between £750-£1000 depending on what needs doing.

If buying one that has already been rebuilt, make sure it's been done at a recognised specialist, i.e. Fudgesmart, WellSmart/Digitec/Smart-Stuff, S2Smarts, BIG Performance, Puresmart, SmartTechnik, Cumbria Smart Cars, Forsmart or McSmarts (have I forgotten anyone?).

Anyone else, then don't asusme it's been done correctly - you could find out it still needs rebuilding again if the mechanic that rebuilt it was not versed with the Smart Suprex engine.#

And as MrPoo says, cheap tax/insurance & fuel bills aside, you should factor in that all of the following are common failure points:
- turbo - expected life approx 80,000 miles (often less if the manifold cracks) - replacement approx £750 inc labour
- clutch - expected life around 80,000 miles - replacement approx £500 inc labour
- there are a whole host of niggly things you'll contend with, such as worn out earth leads, sticky/non-functional door handles, water leaks, failed brake pedal switches, chaffed wiring & gearbox errors, de-sync'd keys....

And they need specialist attention for servicing & repair. The aforementioned garages offer a great service, but you are going to have to be prepared to travel a bit from Lewisham to your nearest specialist - these cars are not to be entrusted to local mechanics, and they're not cheap to maintain if you use propper Mercedes garages.

[LukeM88]

Re: Newbie Warning

£2k is about the entry point for a decent example.
Engines start consuming oil at around 60,000 miles (+/- 20,000) a problem that gets steadily worse until the engine goes pop. The only solution is a rebuild - at a cost of between £750-£1000 depending on what needs doing.

If buying one that has already been rebuilt, make sure it's been done at a recognised specialist, i.e. Fudgesmart, WellSmart/Digitec/Smart-Stuff, S2Smarts, BIG Performance, Puresmart, SmartTechnik, Cumbria Smart Cars, Forsmart or McSmarts (have I forgotten anyone?).

Anyone else, then don't asusme it's been done correctly - you could find out it still needs rebuilding again if the mechanic that rebuilt it was not versed with the Smart Suprex engine.#

And as MrPoo says, cheap tax/insurance & fuel bills aside, you should factor in that all of the following are common failure points:
- turbo - expected life approx 80,000 miles (often less if the manifold cracks) - replacement approx £750 inc labour
- clutch - expected life around 80,000 miles - replacement approx £500 inc labour
- there are a whole host of niggly things you'll contend with, such as worn out earth leads, sticky/non-functional door handles, water leaks, failed brake pedal switches, chaffed wiring & gearbox errors, de-sync'd keys....

And they need specialist attention for servicing & repair. The aforementioned garages offer a great service, but you are going to have to be prepared to travel a bit from Lewisham to your nearest specialist - these cars are not to be entrusted to local mechanics, and they're not cheap to maintain if you use propper Mercedes garages.

Hi Buddy,

thanks for the big incite ! I really need to be careful when buying and viewing one then. Luckily as I said I will be taking a mechanic with me however some of the problems you've listed are not exactly obvious faults to the eye so a great help if we are looking out for certain bits.

would I be best buying one in terms of mileage or age ? from what you have said, im assuming mileage ? I was only looking at getting a newer one (60 bhp model if I could) due to a couple of reviews I have read stating that the 45-50 bhp version are really not that good on the motorway - I wouldn't be travelling far but a good 40 miles down the M20 to see close family!??

Cheers matey

Luke

[137699]

Re: Newbie Warning

Either a very low (sub 30,000 miles) mileage one, or, one that's already been rebuilt.
Or one that's cheap and you can set aside £1000 or so for if/when you need to get it rebuilt.

Always check the oil level. With the engine warm (3 blobs on the temp gauge) & on level ground it should sit around the 3/4 mark up the dipstick between MIN & MAX.
Any lower than half-way then assume it's using oil > and though there may be other reasons (blocked breather or worn turbo) an imminent rebuild is the most likely candidate so factor this into any offer you might make.

Of course a savvy seller will just keep topping up the oil so if it's got a healthy reading, don't assume it means a healthy engine. But a low oil level is a very big red flag!

[Thrumbleux]

Re: Newbie Warning

137 has outlined the engine aspects. Additionally there are electronic issues some of which will prompt the owner into selling rather than fixing. There is a control module in the front passenger footwell (Zee or SAM) and they are easily damaged by moisture so the first check is for damp carpets. Lift them by the doors and at the rear also. Any sign of prolonged damp needs a proper explanation - and a lasting repair (door seals leak as do the rear 3/4 glass/plastic).
In the middle of the speedo there is an LCD display for gears. Any 'bars' showing means trouble, usually at the gearbox. At best it's only a faulty brake light switch or chaffed wiring. At worst a £500 bill can appear from near nowhere.
Damp carpets on a fortwo aren't merely a nuisance - they are a sign of neglect that will cost.
Also, check out the price of a new synchronised key, then the cost of trailering the car to a dealer for same. Deduct some of that from the asking price if both keys aren't present and working.