fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

[kayble]

Hi all,

I've recently been researching veggie oil conversion for diesel engines and hit upon a company that had installed a veggie oil system on a Fortwo CDI. Here's a link:

http://www.dieselveg.com/smart.htm

I was intrigued by the underslung tank and service hole filler neck meaning no tanks in the boot.

I noticed that SRUS had an involvment in the project and to that end I was wondering if anyone on the forum had any info on the conversion?

I'd be particularly interested in hearing about the following:

How the car faired after the conversion - any engine problems etc
Were you able to utilise the plastic undertrays after the conversion
Cost of the conversion


Thanks!

[PeterPiper]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

no tanks in the boot

why would you want a seperate tank for it in t'boot?



that's a converted jerry can painted silver isn't it ?

[kayble]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

why would you want a seperate tank for it in t'boot?

that's my point. Every other conversion on the site shows an auxilliary tank somewhere in the boot or cabin area.

The smart's conversion looks to have a custom fabricated tank slung underneath the car which is pretty impressive - not to mention necessary.

[H Palmer]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

I would say your best bet is to purchase a home refinery kit from some like greenfuels.co.uk. And make a fuel that is suitable for use on any diesel without a need of modification to the vehicle.

One word of advice is that used veg oil is in short supply at the moment because of rising fuel prices.

[PeterPiper]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

custom fabricated tank .

you might call it that , but it's a jerry can

with nasty welding by the looks of it to boot!

[kayble]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

why would you want a seperate tank for it in t'boot?



that's a converted jerry can painted silver isn't it ?

essentially yes but it's the fabrication required to get the brackets right and sling it under the car that's more to the point.

[H Palmer]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

If someone said they fitted an extra fuel tank and I found out they'd strapped a petrol can on the underside I would be seriously worried about the integrity of the entire job!!

[kayble]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

I would say your best bet is to purchase a home refinery kit from some like greenfuels.co.uk. And make a fuel that is suitable for use on any diesel without a need of modification to the vehicle.

One word of advice is that used veg oil is in short supply at the moment because of rising fuel prices.

don't worry about that I live on a site where WVO (waste vegetable oil) and SVO (straight vegetable oil) is in plentiful supply. I'm more interested in a conversion of the vehicle because I don't have the opportunity to locate and store any conversion equipment.

[kayble]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

If someone said they fitted an extra fuel tank and I found out they'd strapped a petrol can on the underside I would be seriously worried about the integrity of the entire job!!

I'm not sure why... the C-Free LPG conversion worked by slinging an LPG tank in pretty much the same location underneath the car...and that was a tank of volatile gas stored at around 8 bar. Granted LPG tanks are crash tested but what I'm talking about here is 22l of veggie oil...not the most volatile of liquids you might say.

[PeterPiper]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

If someone said they fitted an extra fuel tank and I found out they'd strapped a petrol can on the underside I would be seriously worried about the integrity of the entire job!!

:agree: it looks amatuer to me , threy've only got away with because it's not easily flammable (well a high flashpoint)

[H Palmer]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

I'm not sure why... the C-Free LPG conversion worked by slinging an LPG tank in pretty much the same location underneath the car...and that was a tank of volatile gas stored at around 8 bar. Granted LPG tanks are crash tested but what I'm talking about here is 22l of veggie oil...not the most volatile of liquids you might say.

What I meant is that its not specifically fabricated for the job. It doesn't inspire confidence to see a container seemingly bodged into the system. And fuel tanks are nearly always exposed.

And I understand that veg oil is pretty stable substance.

[Keith]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

Hi, Not sure why you need the extra tank. I have been making biodiesel in the garden shed for a while now - you don't need a lot of room or expensive equipment.

I started with fresh veg oil from the cash&carry and processed it in an old Berko boiler. The process for any chemists, is a straightforward esterification of the triglycerides. Basically using sodium hydroxide and methanol the oil is broken down into the glycerol backbone and free fatty acids (the bits you want).

After a bit of washing it's ready for the tank. I have used it with normal mineral diesel and 100% biodiesel and you don't notice any difference in perfromance at all. I'm running a Laguna estate, an old Astra estate and a Jeep.

I'm now using oil from a local chinese restaurant which needs a bit more chemistry - a simple tritration to get the amount of sodium hydroxide right, but that's dead easy really.

The process takes about an hour and as it's a catalised reaction that's the same for whatever amount you are processing.

It's totally legal, you're allowed to make 2500 litres a year for you're own use.

Hope this helps or if you want any more info or a recipe PM me or if you want to see how it's done then you're more than welcome to come over to Nottingham.
Cheers
Keith
(Anton Digital Ltd.)

[Ferrina]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

Good info there Keith, but how expensive is Sodium Hydroxide and the methanol and where do you get it from?

That conversion can only be done on the early ForTwo's due to the smaller 22 litre tank. Later (continental) CDi's have the larger tank like the UK spec petrol. I don't think you need another tank either because at 80mpg, you'll do over 300 miles on a tank anyway!!

There's a good Mini conversion done by www.greasecar.com, using a Rover Metro diesel engine (same as a citroen/pug 1.5 lump) but in a Clubman. Could be the next thing I do on my car!!!

[Keith]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

The sodium hydroxide was about £10 (I think) for 25kg but you only use about 34g per 10 litres of oil so it lasts a while and haven't bought any resently. The methanol is around £18 for 25 litres you use 2 litres per 10 litres of oil.

There is a place up in Lymm near Warrington that I get all my reagents from - Trinity Research - www.trinity-research.co.uk. It's handy for me as it's close to where my parents live but they do post out. On eBay you'll find lots of people selling the reagents - just try to get the purest quality you can.

Cheers
Keith
(Anton Digital Ltd.)

[Ferrina]

Re: fortwo CDI veggie oil conversion information

Thanks for that, it's something that I've been reading about over the past few years, but never had the vehicle or space to set up safely. Could possibly be the fuel source for my newest car project......