Do Roadster Gear Change Timings change with a Remap?

[alchemistkevin]

1...
I've seen lots of people claiming their gear changes were faster after a remap, but nobody has ever had conclusive evidence.

Having spoken to a remapper who was willing to discuss how maps work; told me in detail about what parameters they change in a map and what all it alters for the engine to work differently and how it produces higher output (or higher turbo boost)

He, however, categorically stated that even though the gear changes might feel faster, it's all down to perception and nothing to do with the map. ie: A map doesn't change gear change timings. period.

Could someone with knowledge of writing maps or how maps work comment on this please, as I find it quite astounding when so many people 'think' their car's changing gear faster after having a remap.

2...
Also, has anybody ever seen a roady that changes gear almost immediately? I had mine with paddleshift and it was amazing the way it used to shift gears, I never had any complaints like slow shifts, it was certainly faster than a car with manual gears. So, wondering if mine was different or are all the cars same but people just have a habit of thinking it's slow, just coz they're not taking time themselves to use the clutch, change gear, accelerate...

[blondster1983]

Re: Do Roadster Gear Change Timings change with a Remap?

With a very well-adjusted clutch the gearchanges are very good i have found... But you need to keep it adjusted or else it gradually worsens.

In some ways my remap could have made the gearchanges feel worse, it depends on how I'm driving. If I allow it to rev through then they are very smooth, if i get it on boost and then short-shift it's very jerky, as the power is "surging" (purely down to style of driving, not the map).

I like having to think about how I'm driving, since it connects you with the car more, and makes you more aware of surroundings etc.

I knwo that some people were looking at uprating components of the gearbox to speed it up... but have heard no more info on this as of yet...

[bus_ter]

Re: Do Roadster Gear Change Timings change with a Remap?

I'm not sure about this. I have a remap and it does feel like the gear changes 'may' be faster. However because you go through the revs quicker, and have to change gears sooner and more often, I think you get the illusion that the gear changes are also quicker.

Remaps get the extra power by boosting the turbo higher, and allowing more fuel and air into the cylinders at the same time. AFAIK the ECU sends a signal to the gear box saying you want to change gear. At this point the gearbox lifts the clutch, moves some gears around and then re-engages the clutch. The speed that this happens is limited by the gearbox itself. I don't see how this can be made to go any faster by new ECU software that tells it when to change gear?

Having said this, some of the remappers do claim that the gear change speed is increased. Interestingly SW-Exclusive do a remap that doesn't increase the power, just purely to increase the gear change speed. See http://www.sw-exclusive.co.uk/fortwo_tuning_98.htm

One way to 'Improve' (read 'not necessary speed up') gear changes is to fit an uprated clutch. A remapped Smart will be operating beyond the specs of the clutch. Even when you don't feel the clutch slipping it can be, and a remmaped car will need the clutch adjusted regularly (every service would be ideal). The Smart times test For-two had an article about fitting an upated Clutch, before they fitted this they didn't really think there was a problem with the clutch. However with the new clutch it was biting much better and gear changes were improved, The standard clutch was slipping into gear, this was just gripping and going.

I find the gear changes fine for normal driving. The only time the gear box annoys me is when driving hard and needing to downshift through several gears. There is a tight hair-pin at Knockhill racing circuit where you need to drop from 5th gear to 2nd and then be right back on the power. Well you're not! It takes a good couple of seconds to change down 3 gears. I think this is because it's a sequential gear box, and it has to work it's way down through three gears before engaging the clutch in 2nd.

[epitrochoid]

Re: Do Roadster Gear Change Timings change with a Remap?

There is no code in the map to change the shift time of the gearbox. What makes it feel faster is perhaps tyhe car learning your newer quick driving style with a remap, and actuating the clutch accordingly, or, perhaps the timings of the remap and the speed at which the engine spins down when the throttle is lifted just matches the revs better than the standard map. I know the standard map if you revved up really high and let go of the throttle, it took ages to wind down. On my remap the revs fall quicker. So when you change the revs are well matched to tne new gearbox speed so the clutch closing is smooth and doesnt have to drag the engine revs down to the gearbox speed.

Thats my take on it anyway.

[alchemistkevin]

Re: Do Roadster Gear Change Timings change with a Remap?

After posting the query, I've learnt that there actually is some code that can be changed to get a quicker gear change.

How do you do this?

I don't know.

Which remaps do and don't affect gear change timings?

I don't know. (except for the people I've spoken to)

The fact that some maps change gear change timgs - comes from a VERY reliable source, so I'm gonna believe it.

Who said this? I won't make this public... but one thing is for sure - this matter is as clear as mud!

We know a lot of people who remap smarts would have read this post and none (except the ones whom I've spoken to privately) have responded to this - Apologies for being very direct and blunt guys, but I think your customers need to know if your remaps do or don't change the gear change timings....

can't you just be honest and say so?

[bluewaver]

Re: Do Roadster Gear Change Timings change with a Remap?

I cant comment on maps because mine is standard..but my gearchange used to be bang on ie. really quick. This all of a sudden changed and now it disengages straight away but seems to pause longer before re-engaging to next gear?! I took it back to smart and they said nothing was wrong when they took it for a spin, it doesnt need adjusting etc etc. He said the gearbox learns your driving style........but this does not explain why it has slowed down all of a sudden!!!! Instead they said they would 'reset' the gearbox so it had to re-learn (or something to that effect!) This has made no difference at all! The car is getting remapped next week though, so I will see if this does have any affect in this area!!

[blondster1983]

Re: Do Roadster Gear Change Timings change with a Remap?

I had that... Had remap it stayed the same. Had smartarse manually adjust the clutch and it was perfect for a bit!

Get the clutch adjusted manually and electronically, and I'm pretty certain this will sort it...